We moved to Lisbon a year ago and the number of “you were prescient” and “how do we do what you did?” messages has been staggering. We are still numb ourselves and we haven’t even started to reply. I will say that the joy of traveling the world and discovering new places and making new friends has far outweighed the challenges. Just last week I asked my husband how a kid from Ohio ended up with friends from Brazil, Venezuela, and Argentina…places we still haven’t even visited. I wish all of your readers whatever path forward will bring them peace. Regretfully, mere distance doesn’t mitigate the sense of disorientation and loss.
Please🙏🏻 we are thinking of it as one of my daughter's lives there. But another lives next to me. Do you have a post dedicated to your relocation tips?
I started having discussions with my partner of (now) 30 years about leaving the U.S. when Trump was elected back in 2016. "How bad could it be?" Was the constant refrain. We found out but it seems a lot of American voters have a very selective memory and they were the ones who showed up at the voting boxes.
Here we are again. And I'm retirement optional now. Given where I work (both location and organization), I can clearly see the sausage making of government and I'm directly impacted by it. My partner is a hard "no" on leaving while I'm a hard "no" on staying.
We'll see where this ends. I've already lived abroad so I have a very clear idea of the culture shock and hardships one can experience. And as a military brat, I can't count the number of times I've moved already. I have no illusions of this being easy. It's just a matter of whether I think it's worse to go or stay. Having seen Act I, I know Act II will be worse. Much worse. The gloves are off and guard rails gone.
Hi Jim, Hopefully a little more time and lots of discussions will bring you to a point of mutual agreement. Maybe try living somewhere for a couple of months? At least give him a chance to get a taste of it.
He's beyond retirement age but insists on continuing to work. He's one of those people who seemingly will not retire. That factors into the equation. We've talked about living elsewhere for a while but that never seems to materialize. I have medical issues which require attention every 6 weeks so anything beyond that is difficult. And yes, having lived and traveled abroad extensively, I am aware of what that does for medical care. I'm being cautious about what countries I am looking at. I have family and land in Germany and my father came over on the boat. That's my focus. And I know about medical insurance.
Jim, maybe you should consider Mexico, specifically San Miguel de Allende, which has large cities all around ( Queretaro and Guanajuato) which all have wonderful health care, and you'd be a 2 hour flight from San Antonio for really serious (expensive) procedures. It’s at least something to consider.
Brent and Michael, thanks for this post today. I’m stunned and appalled by the election results, but I’m reading the many opinion columns and analysis of why/how Trump won and finding that I’m understanding things a little differently. I’m an ardent Democrat, but I’m also highly educated and well off. The gist of what I’m reading is that the Democratic party could not (did not) effectively address the grievances and economic hardships of non-college educated, working class Americans who care more about their next pay check than they do about “saving democracy.” That kinda makes sense and explains their vote. At the same time, that so many Americans could overlook that DT is a convicted criminal, a liar, a misogynist, a lifelong grifter, and a mad man, is hard to wrap my mind around. As for where my husband and I will live, we expect to stay in the U.S. where we have six grandchildren we want to see as much as possible. Not a perfect solution. I said to Sam this AM, could we live in France for six months? He replied yes.
We've been reading the same news and I do get it. But the ignorance about the causes of the economic conditions and their willingness to believe Trump will fix it is appalling. I've also been reading about the numbers of different groups who simply wouldn't vote for a woman is appalling. Enjoy France! Sounds like a great solution.
A black woman? even worse. It revealed who we are. A mirror of the present reality: a racist, misogynist, ignorant, biased country of 338.000.000 of which 75M have their mouths full of Scripture and 🖤 full of hate.
And to think this individual is allowed to treat patients. Don't bother responding. I'm leaving this nastiness -- and have screenshots -- but anything else you post will be deleted.
Yes, I've been reading that too, and I'm trying hard to wrap my mind around it, especially since the economy is so much better than the rest of the world. And yeah, even if that is all true, why elect a man who will make things worse?
Debbie I also have 6 grandkids. I'm torn because I'm Venezuelan and I KNOW what's coming. 🎃II will be much worse. He will have unbridled power. No guardrails. But this art IMO explains a lot.
I so relate to this comment. Reading all of the reasons people voted the way they did is certainly understandable and criticisms of the far left are valid. But the far right has gone so incredibly far. We're heading over to New Zealand for the start of the year and we'll be monitoring how things go.
Those comments you received, Michael - I feel a bit speechless at the level of hatred. I'm so sorry that you have to field that. I fear for my kid's and their friend's futures in a world with so much hate and ignorance. We're currently in plans to make the move out of here, but as someone else said, it's a bit more complicated when you've got adult kids with lives here. If it was just me, I'd be on a plane next week!
Thanks, Tree. It's not like I didn't know garbage like this existed or that I haven't been exposed to it before. But the level and ferocity and outright viciousness of it did knock me back on my heels a bit. I hope you figure out the right way forward for you.
I'm sure the working class will be thrilled when they realize they voted for massive tax cuts for the rich financed by...what a minute! The working class?
While I'm inclined to agree with you, from the Trump supporters in my social circle of family and (a few) friends, none of that will matter. Their orange jeebus will simply declare that everything is wonderful, and that any problems are the fault of Obamacare/Biden/Mexicans/Whatever. And the brainless, brainwashed masses of the MAGA cult will believe it. Based empirically on the MAGA cultists in my own family, I think half of them know that they're being for fools, but they're afraid to admit it because it would require them to acknowledge that they are the fools in that relationship. So they cling to the "Trump Is Our Savior" bulls-stuff to protect their delicate feelings.
We are in a true fact-free world now. Facts are whatever the cult's Dear Leader declares them to be, even if it's completely and demonstrably false.
So true about the world. My first post election email was from a friend from Ireland offering condolences and whether we had already purchased our home in Spain. Our house has sold, leaving for southern Spain the first or second week of January.
My husband and I are also DONE. He, his supporters, his vile family and his traitorous enablers have occupied so much negativity in our hearts and brains for far too long . Life is simply too short to be this mentally exhausted all the time,
Excited for our new adventure, and looking forward to a lot of traveling!
I hear you, and I totally feel what you're feeling. The things I hear from acquaintances -- the EXCUSES, the false equivalencies -- I just can't handle it anymore.
I just read your article a minute ago and cried! Lots of my colleagues and friends have been crying over the last 2 days. I am so sorry you received those vile comments on social media. Social media needs to have some laws just as TV does, it is one of the reason trump won. You both are wonderful and inspiring, someone my teenager can look up to. We are looking at moving abroad...but have 2 cats and 2 golden retriever's and a teenage son (: Lots of love and strength to you both, and thanks so much for what you do!
I'm writing an essay on what it means to leave your country. Except my home country isn't America. There's so much painful irony in what's going on here, for me, and many other immigrants. Will share.
That why I'm on the fence. I already left my country, Venezuela for a new marriage, to be near two of my daughters and 5 grandkids. Now 12 yrs later another door slams in my face, do I pick myself up, pack my house, learn Portuguese, move my cats and relocate again? At 73 with an ailing husband?
Hola! Super important to be close to family. IMHO it's too soon to make a judgment on whether or not to leave, and each one of us has different circumstances to consider. If you leave, don't make it about an election. Make it about what you want out of life. And if the two coincide, great. If they don't, stay and support your local community!
For many reasons this essay pushed me to finally subscribe. Thank you again for your words and your courage. At some point as we both wander around the world, it would be nice to share a coffee and some conversation in person. Wishing you both the best.
PS I’d love to read a draft of your Seattle pro / con essay. I’m headed back to the US for some business junk and I go through the same essay process each time as well.
Thank you for subscribing, Matthew. It is VERY much appreciated. And it would be lovely to meet up. That's been one of the best parts of being nomadic.
As for the pro/con essay, well, mine got written but now Brent and I are on the same page, so I'm not sure the con will ever get written. Oh, we each took the opposite position of how we usually feel to make it more interesting.
I left in 2019 with my family. It was a very difficult decision because not that many people saw what I saw coming. Now, among all of the intense emotions the election is stirring up, there is a sense of vindication. In fact, my 82-year-old mother said yesterday that I was right to leave the U.S. That is a sea change.
I have said since he left office that if he were ever re-elected I would not stay in the US. I was lucky enough to spend much of Covid in the Algarve and early Wednesday morning, I contacted them to see if the wonderful little house in the village was available. Thankfully it was, and I booked my flight and will land in Portugal on January 16th. I will remain there my allotted 3-Schengen months and then either come back for just enough time to secure a long-term stay Visa or maybe head to Ireland or England for another 6 months. And I always have my Residente card for Mexico. so another option is available. But no option will lure me back to the States while he and his minions are in office. I just don't want to be near and hear the constant, vial, rhetoric that will pour out of his mouth while he destroys my beautiful country. So if you two are headed back to the Continent after your sojourn in PV, let me know!
We have several friends who are looking to GTFO but many don't have that option. We're never moving back and after my Mom is gone, we'll have no reason to visit.
I wish we could leave, but I don’t trust that my Social Security check will be coming forever or even much longer. So we have to depend on my son’s income, which requires staying put in a red state. Not happy about that.
First, I'm so sorry about the hateful things people have said to you on social media. You should not be treated that way, no one should. For what little it's worth, I'm sending you both love and support to try to counteract whatever damage the hate may have done.
Second, you make very good points about how intertwined American politics are with the rest of the world and the globally shifting pattern of beliefs right now. No place may be truly "safe" (whatever that means), but the idea of making a personal choice about how - and where - we want to spend the rest of our lives - that really resonates.
Thanks, Sarah. I admit it rattled my cage the first couple of days. But I now deal with them very quickly. Here's hoping things turn out to be better than so many of us fear.
I left after his first election and agree it is the best decision I ever made. Unfortunately I also agree that his second term could do so much damage to the world. Still I am much happier living outside the US.
We moved to Lisbon a year ago and the number of “you were prescient” and “how do we do what you did?” messages has been staggering. We are still numb ourselves and we haven’t even started to reply. I will say that the joy of traveling the world and discovering new places and making new friends has far outweighed the challenges. Just last week I asked my husband how a kid from Ohio ended up with friends from Brazil, Venezuela, and Argentina…places we still haven’t even visited. I wish all of your readers whatever path forward will bring them peace. Regretfully, mere distance doesn’t mitigate the sense of disorientation and loss.
You are right about the distance not mitigating the awfulness. I'm still reeling. But I love hearing another positive story!
Yes exactly! Every time a foreign country is mentioned, I think, "Oh, we have a friend there."
Please🙏🏻 we are thinking of it as one of my daughter's lives there. But another lives next to me. Do you have a post dedicated to your relocation tips?
I started having discussions with my partner of (now) 30 years about leaving the U.S. when Trump was elected back in 2016. "How bad could it be?" Was the constant refrain. We found out but it seems a lot of American voters have a very selective memory and they were the ones who showed up at the voting boxes.
Here we are again. And I'm retirement optional now. Given where I work (both location and organization), I can clearly see the sausage making of government and I'm directly impacted by it. My partner is a hard "no" on leaving while I'm a hard "no" on staying.
We'll see where this ends. I've already lived abroad so I have a very clear idea of the culture shock and hardships one can experience. And as a military brat, I can't count the number of times I've moved already. I have no illusions of this being easy. It's just a matter of whether I think it's worse to go or stay. Having seen Act I, I know Act II will be worse. Much worse. The gloves are off and guard rails gone.
Hi Jim, Hopefully a little more time and lots of discussions will bring you to a point of mutual agreement. Maybe try living somewhere for a couple of months? At least give him a chance to get a taste of it.
He's beyond retirement age but insists on continuing to work. He's one of those people who seemingly will not retire. That factors into the equation. We've talked about living elsewhere for a while but that never seems to materialize. I have medical issues which require attention every 6 weeks so anything beyond that is difficult. And yes, having lived and traveled abroad extensively, I am aware of what that does for medical care. I'm being cautious about what countries I am looking at. I have family and land in Germany and my father came over on the boat. That's my focus. And I know about medical insurance.
Jim, maybe you should consider Mexico, specifically San Miguel de Allende, which has large cities all around ( Queretaro and Guanajuato) which all have wonderful health care, and you'd be a 2 hour flight from San Antonio for really serious (expensive) procedures. It’s at least something to consider.
It's very true, bros and cons for sure. But yeah, I think Act 2 will be much much worse.
Brent and Michael, thanks for this post today. I’m stunned and appalled by the election results, but I’m reading the many opinion columns and analysis of why/how Trump won and finding that I’m understanding things a little differently. I’m an ardent Democrat, but I’m also highly educated and well off. The gist of what I’m reading is that the Democratic party could not (did not) effectively address the grievances and economic hardships of non-college educated, working class Americans who care more about their next pay check than they do about “saving democracy.” That kinda makes sense and explains their vote. At the same time, that so many Americans could overlook that DT is a convicted criminal, a liar, a misogynist, a lifelong grifter, and a mad man, is hard to wrap my mind around. As for where my husband and I will live, we expect to stay in the U.S. where we have six grandchildren we want to see as much as possible. Not a perfect solution. I said to Sam this AM, could we live in France for six months? He replied yes.
We've been reading the same news and I do get it. But the ignorance about the causes of the economic conditions and their willingness to believe Trump will fix it is appalling. I've also been reading about the numbers of different groups who simply wouldn't vote for a woman is appalling. Enjoy France! Sounds like a great solution.
A black woman? even worse. It revealed who we are. A mirror of the present reality: a racist, misogynist, ignorant, biased country of 338.000.000 of which 75M have their mouths full of Scripture and 🖤 full of hate.
1000%
And to think this individual is allowed to treat patients. Don't bother responding. I'm leaving this nastiness -- and have screenshots -- but anything else you post will be deleted.
You are a physician? Shameful!
Sorry, removed the wrong comment!
You really might want to reconsider coming here and spewing your nastiness everywhere.
Yes, I've been reading that too, and I'm trying hard to wrap my mind around it, especially since the economy is so much better than the rest of the world. And yeah, even if that is all true, why elect a man who will make things worse?
Debbie I also have 6 grandkids. I'm torn because I'm Venezuelan and I KNOW what's coming. 🎃II will be much worse. He will have unbridled power. No guardrails. But this art IMO explains a lot.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/11/06/opinion/trump-wins-harris-loses.html?unlocked_article_code=1.YE4.CO2m.zyCgJfFbe34d&smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
I so relate to this comment. Reading all of the reasons people voted the way they did is certainly understandable and criticisms of the far left are valid. But the far right has gone so incredibly far. We're heading over to New Zealand for the start of the year and we'll be monitoring how things go.
Great country. Have a wonderful time!
Check this article out:
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/11/06/opinion/trump-wins-harris-loses.html?unlocked_article_code=1.YE4.CO2m.zyCgJfFbe34d&smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
Those comments you received, Michael - I feel a bit speechless at the level of hatred. I'm so sorry that you have to field that. I fear for my kid's and their friend's futures in a world with so much hate and ignorance. We're currently in plans to make the move out of here, but as someone else said, it's a bit more complicated when you've got adult kids with lives here. If it was just me, I'd be on a plane next week!
Thanks, Tree. It's not like I didn't know garbage like this existed or that I haven't been exposed to it before. But the level and ferocity and outright viciousness of it did knock me back on my heels a bit. I hope you figure out the right way forward for you.
"the coterie of grifters, yes-men, and truly scary ideologues that now surround him."
That actually scares me more than Trump himself, due to the ease in which he can be manipulated.
100%. And I'm pretty sure Vance will be president before the end of the term, so there's that to stress about.
That’s definitely what’s about to happen.
Michael Flynn Steve Bannon JD Vance Cory Landowski and on and on and on.
Imagine the tech broligarchs who will be the real Board of Directors with Vance as Janitor.
I'm sure the working class will be thrilled when they realize they voted for massive tax cuts for the rich financed by...what a minute! The working class?
They could have googled and checked.
While I'm inclined to agree with you, from the Trump supporters in my social circle of family and (a few) friends, none of that will matter. Their orange jeebus will simply declare that everything is wonderful, and that any problems are the fault of Obamacare/Biden/Mexicans/Whatever. And the brainless, brainwashed masses of the MAGA cult will believe it. Based empirically on the MAGA cultists in my own family, I think half of them know that they're being for fools, but they're afraid to admit it because it would require them to acknowledge that they are the fools in that relationship. So they cling to the "Trump Is Our Savior" bulls-stuff to protect their delicate feelings.
We are in a true fact-free world now. Facts are whatever the cult's Dear Leader declares them to be, even if it's completely and demonstrably false.
That’s hilarious, what a tragicomedy!
So true about the world. My first post election email was from a friend from Ireland offering condolences and whether we had already purchased our home in Spain. Our house has sold, leaving for southern Spain the first or second week of January.
My husband and I are also DONE. He, his supporters, his vile family and his traitorous enablers have occupied so much negativity in our hearts and brains for far too long . Life is simply too short to be this mentally exhausted all the time,
Excited for our new adventure, and looking forward to a lot of traveling!
I hear you, and I totally feel what you're feeling. The things I hear from acquaintances -- the EXCUSES, the false equivalencies -- I just can't handle it anymore.
So glad you're embarking on this journey and living a life you love.
I just read your article a minute ago and cried! Lots of my colleagues and friends have been crying over the last 2 days. I am so sorry you received those vile comments on social media. Social media needs to have some laws just as TV does, it is one of the reason trump won. You both are wonderful and inspiring, someone my teenager can look up to. We are looking at moving abroad...but have 2 cats and 2 golden retriever's and a teenage son (: Lots of love and strength to you both, and thanks so much for what you do!
Thank you, appreciate that very much.
Thanks so much, Christina. Love and strength back to you. And pet those cats and dogs for me!
Speaking of dogs and cats, I am thinking pretty impossible to bring them until we find a permanent place?
Some folks do travel with a pet but it isn't very easy. And four would be really tough. Sorry...
I'm writing an essay on what it means to leave your country. Except my home country isn't America. There's so much painful irony in what's going on here, for me, and many other immigrants. Will share.
I can't imagine.
Look forward to reading it.
As an American (now nomading), I'd like to read that, too.
Please🙏🏻
Here it is, thank you all! https://themuse.substack.com/p/flight-to-freedom
I'd like to read it too.
That why I'm on the fence. I already left my country, Venezuela for a new marriage, to be near two of my daughters and 5 grandkids. Now 12 yrs later another door slams in my face, do I pick myself up, pack my house, learn Portuguese, move my cats and relocate again? At 73 with an ailing husband?
Hola! Super important to be close to family. IMHO it's too soon to make a judgment on whether or not to leave, and each one of us has different circumstances to consider. If you leave, don't make it about an election. Make it about what you want out of life. And if the two coincide, great. If they don't, stay and support your local community!
Great advice! Yeah, Trump was the catalyst but this was something we wanted to do even if at the time we didn't know exactly what it would look like.
For many reasons this essay pushed me to finally subscribe. Thank you again for your words and your courage. At some point as we both wander around the world, it would be nice to share a coffee and some conversation in person. Wishing you both the best.
PS I’d love to read a draft of your Seattle pro / con essay. I’m headed back to the US for some business junk and I go through the same essay process each time as well.
thanks Mathew! Much appreciated. Coffee for sure.
Thank you for subscribing, Matthew. It is VERY much appreciated. And it would be lovely to meet up. That's been one of the best parts of being nomadic.
As for the pro/con essay, well, mine got written but now Brent and I are on the same page, so I'm not sure the con will ever get written. Oh, we each took the opposite position of how we usually feel to make it more interesting.
I left in 2019 with my family. It was a very difficult decision because not that many people saw what I saw coming. Now, among all of the intense emotions the election is stirring up, there is a sense of vindication. In fact, my 82-year-old mother said yesterday that I was right to leave the U.S. That is a sea change.
I wish we had been wrong to leave in 2016. I really WANTED to be wrong. But alas...
So sad that all of this even has to be an issue…
I have said since he left office that if he were ever re-elected I would not stay in the US. I was lucky enough to spend much of Covid in the Algarve and early Wednesday morning, I contacted them to see if the wonderful little house in the village was available. Thankfully it was, and I booked my flight and will land in Portugal on January 16th. I will remain there my allotted 3-Schengen months and then either come back for just enough time to secure a long-term stay Visa or maybe head to Ireland or England for another 6 months. And I always have my Residente card for Mexico. so another option is available. But no option will lure me back to the States while he and his minions are in office. I just don't want to be near and hear the constant, vial, rhetoric that will pour out of his mouth while he destroys my beautiful country. So if you two are headed back to the Continent after your sojourn in PV, let me know!
Glad you have a plan, ReAnn! After Mexico, pretty sure we are headed for Japan!
Yes, we hear you very loud and clear. We have really loved the UK, and I appreciate their six month visa on arrival option.
Sorry we missed you in PV!
We have several friends who are looking to GTFO but many don't have that option. We're never moving back and after my Mom is gone, we'll have no reason to visit.
It's true, not all can. A good point (I've made it in many other articles on this topic, but no room in this one.)
I'm sure there are many good points that should go without saying but sadly need repeating over and over.
Have already followed your example and probably won’t look back.
Travel tells us that “American Exceptionalism” is exaggerated. This election proves it is myth.
Let’s watch from a distance to see if they can build the Hell they say they want.
Exactly exactly exactly. Exaggerated and maybe even completely bullshit!
Yes, watch from afar -- like from the Undying Lands in Tolkien. I'll go back when Galadriel does.
Sad, but true.
Have a good afternoon creating some artful photos, Michael.
I wish we could leave, but I don’t trust that my Social Security check will be coming forever or even much longer. So we have to depend on my son’s income, which requires staying put in a red state. Not happy about that.
Totally get that. And yeah, I agree with you on SS.
Thinking about taking social security sooner than planned since it likely won’t be around.
I took mine at the earliest opportunity for exactly the same reason. I wanted to collect what I could before it is gone.
First, I'm so sorry about the hateful things people have said to you on social media. You should not be treated that way, no one should. For what little it's worth, I'm sending you both love and support to try to counteract whatever damage the hate may have done.
Second, you make very good points about how intertwined American politics are with the rest of the world and the globally shifting pattern of beliefs right now. No place may be truly "safe" (whatever that means), but the idea of making a personal choice about how - and where - we want to spend the rest of our lives - that really resonates.
There are no "wrong" choices, except maybe complete despair. People will find their way, I hope.
Thanks for the nice words.
Thanks, Sarah. I admit it rattled my cage the first couple of days. But I now deal with them very quickly. Here's hoping things turn out to be better than so many of us fear.
I left after his first election and agree it is the best decision I ever made. Unfortunately I also agree that his second term could do so much damage to the world. Still I am much happier living outside the US.
We obviously agree on both counts.